Curse

deathwearer · Jun 24, 2005, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dyeeo

I would set a base price but not limit how high it can go. Kind of like the materials.

exactly.

Cap'n Hoek · Jun 24, 2005, 07:10 PM // 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rasp

It's not about a Grind. YOU are making this into a grind. You do NOT need the 15k armors.

Again, it's all in YOUR head. The grind is brought upon players by themselves being greedy, and want want want.

Clear your mind and relax, young grasshopper. It'll all come to you.

Umm, hey guy? Go and read this thread again. Then you might actually understand that what you are saying is EXACTLY what I am saying.

Stop with the Q-tip before it hurts, okay?

Fire Childe · Jun 24, 2005, 07:12 PM // 19:12

Quote:

hmm reading these posts kinda makes me wonder.. to those that want more gold to buy the best armor.. what will you do once you obtain the best armor/weapons...

wear it probably.

in all seriousness, the fissure armour is a goal that players set themselves to pad out the time till the next expansion. that will bring with it new goals.

its not a particularly fantastic gaming model and GW is not by any means the first game to use it. many mmos work like this for example.

but it says alot about the degrading and embarassing game model online rpgs adopt if it takes this long to obtain something in a game and where playing it feels more like work. this is of course taking into account the most viable 'other' option you can fall back on - which is to not bother at all. in which case, theres not really much left for me to do. think i will pick up that copy of GTA:SA then...

Rasp · Jun 24, 2005, 07:12 PM // 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fire Childe

you are of course correct in a way.

but i ask you.

if you play predominantly pve. what seriously is there to do once you have completed all the missions and played fissure and underworld a bunch till you got bored?

once you have the weapons you need, a bunch of skills unlocked, there is *nothing* left to do pve side other than customise your character. go and buy armour. etc. its like a new goal you can set yourself albeit you are limited in choice and all are expensive. the fissure set is especially, horrendously expensive. but the other alternative is to...do what?

buy GTA: SA and play that instead? hardly a viable alternative although it would certainly work.

This is just IMHO, this game was never designed to be another typical MMORPG, where the PvE side lasts for so long. I've always thought of this game, since I've first read about it, to be PvP mainly. After completing the game upto Ring of Fire (haven't bothered with the PvE side much since that point, too boring for me), I've noticed even more that this game is IMO designed for PvP.

If you want the game to be more PvE based, then I think A.Net are doing a fine job. How many other typical MMORPGs can you achieve ALL your goals so fast? I've never played a MMORPG where I could 'easily' get the last armor available to me. The fact that it takes so long to get the final armor, seems to add longetivity to the PvE side. If they reduced the 'grind' to get the final armors, what would there be left for the PvE'ers? Not much, if anything at all. What's the other alternative once you've gotten your 15k armor?

Just play GTA: SA, it's a great game.

Cap'n Hoek · Jun 24, 2005, 07:13 PM // 19:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

I have no idea what you're talking about....and I'm quite certain you don't either.

Actually I'm quite clear on the matter. Reading comprehension is my friend.

See Spot Run. Run Spot Run.

Ba Ne · Jun 24, 2005, 07:18 PM // 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aug

The 15k armor was not meant to be obtainable just by completing the game. That armor is for the addicts. The hardcore PvEers. Not the casual gamer that spent 100-200 hours in game and put the game down after they finished Hell's Precipice.

The 15k armor is there for those who've spent 400+ hours in game, run FoW/UW half a dozen times, or done tons of exploration.

Says who? You? Just curious, because I'd like to read the same info you did.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mistress Dasha

hmm reading these posts kinda makes me wonder.. to those that want more gold to buy the best armor.. what will you do once you obtain the best armor/weapons...

Ideally (in my world anyway) you'd reach the 3/4's complete mark or so, maybe more, obtain the best there is (through normal gameplay) and then enjoy the last 1/4 of the game using your items. After the game is finished, put it down until the expansion is out and then continue on.

This game is essentially a SP RPG that you can co-op with real people online. Once you beat the story of a SP RPG do you keep playing just to farm items? For what purpose since there is no more quests/missions to do? Of course you don't. You expect to obtain them while still having things left to do so when you reach the endgame you've experienced all you could.

Algren Cole · Jun 24, 2005, 07:18 PM // 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cap'n Hoek

Actually I'm quite clear on the matter. Reading comprehension is my friend.

See Spot Run. Run Spot Run.

right....only nothing you've said pertains to me at all...since I'm not complaining about the grind....

Rasp · Jun 24, 2005, 07:25 PM // 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cap'n Hoek

Umm, hey guy? Go and read this thread again. Then you might actually understand that what you are saying is EXACTLY what I am saying.

Stop with the Q-tip before it hurts, okay?

Oh, oops. I have made a mistake. I have gotten your posts confused with others.

It must be the witty sarcastic troll remarks that you're using to raise your e-Ego +1 that got me confused. So sorry.

Kids these days, and their sarcasm.

Aug · Jun 24, 2005, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ba Ne

Ideally (in my world anyway) you'd reach the 3/4's complete mark or so, maybe more, obtain the best there is (through normal gameplay) and then enjoy the last 1/4 of the game using your items. After the game is finished, put it down until the expansion is out and then continue on.

This game is essentially a SP RPG that you can co-op with real people online. Once you beat the story of a SP RPG do you keep playing just to farm items? For what purpose since there is no more quests/missions to do? Of course you don't. You expect to obtain them while still having things left to do so when you reach the endgame you've experienced all you could.

You did obtain the best there was at 3/4 game play! The 1.5K armor is as good as it gets, mechanically speaking.

In your 'ideal world', what do the people who want to achieve the most do? In your 'ideal world', there are no hardcore gamers. Everyone just stops playing the game after the last cutscene, because they've done everything.

Your ideal world isn't very ideal. Or even realistic.

Fire Childe · Jun 24, 2005, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rasp

This is just IMHO, this game was never designed to be another typical MMORPG, where the PvE side lasts for so long. I've always thought of this game, since I've first read about it, to be PvP mainly. After completing the game upto Ring of Fire (haven't bothered with the PvE side much since that point, too boring for me), I've noticed even more that this game is IMO designed for PvP.

If you want the game to be more PvE based, then I think A.Net are doing a fine job. How many other typical MMORPGs can you achieve ALL your goals so fast? I've never played a MMORPG where I could 'easily' get the last armor available to me. The fact that it takes so long to get the final armor, seems to add longetivity to the PvE side. If they reduced the 'grind' to get the final armors, what would there be left for the PvE'ers? Not much, if anything at all. What's the other alternative once you've gotten your 15k armor?

Just play GTA: SA, it's a great game.

to say this game is mainly pvp or mainly pve is to miss the point somewhat. people will play the game in whatever way they get the most fun out of. for some people this is tombing every night. for others its doing a story mission. for some its sitting, chatting and dying your armour freaky colours. for others its camping the material trader and buying low. then selling high. the would be stock brokers and economists of guild wars.

some of those i find fun. others not. anet dont dictate a specific way to play this game. they leave it up to people to enjoy it in any way they can.

as for your point about other mmos. you are correct on that one. but that just highlights absolutely everything that was wrong about mmo's before GW if they demanded even more time and social life than this one does now. with ffxi its hard to believe people would tolerate that kind of grind. only in GW you get the empty grind of the old online rpg type formula. just less of it. it doesnt change the fundamental dynamic of games like d2 for example.

and yes, if the fissure armours were made easily available there would be nothing left to do. you are right. that kind of suggests there wasnt much substance to it in the first place. nowhere is that made more starkely evident than the pve side of this game. its on rails. its linear. and its short. and once you've done it. theres little incentive to do it again.

the online rpg formula relies on grind to exist. there isnt really much to online rpgs. what is there is padded out with the need to kill 1 million monsters to get 1000 exp to get 1 level which will allow you to increase 1 tiny stat point which will make your character a fraction stronger. padding out pretty much sums up alot of online rpgs. diablo 2 was all pad. guild wars has less of it for the most part. but then it just means you get to the end of it quicker and realise sooner there isnt really much here in the first place.

guild wars pve uses the same mechanic as the standard online rpg. just shortens the steps in between. it does however show up everything that was shallow and hollow about online rpgs in the first place.

Mistress Dasha · Jun 24, 2005, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fire Childe

wear it probably.

in all seriousness, the fissure armour is a goal that players set themselves to pad out the time till the next expansion. that will bring with it new goals.

its not a particularly fantastic gaming model and GW is not by any means the first game to use it. many mmos work like this for example.

but it says alot about the degrading and embarassing game model online rpgs adopt if it takes this long to obtain something in a game and where playing it feels more like work. this is of course taking into account the most viable 'other' option you can fall back on - which is to not bother at all. in which case, theres not really much left for me to do. think i will pick up that copy of GTA:SA then...

thanks for pointing out the obvious... again when you have your fissure armour then what... your prolly going to stop playing and by your post you prolly will stop before you acomplish your goal..

many appologies didnt mean to flame but a stupid comment deserves one

Cap'n Hoek · Jun 24, 2005, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

...since I'm not complaining about the grind....

Yeah, you only like to proclaim the "truth" regarding ANet's lack of a plan when they do things such as introduce a rune trader to alleviate the grind of rune farming.

Memory = good. You should try it.

Algren Cole · Jun 24, 2005, 07:33 PM // 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cap'n Hoek

Yeah, you only like to proclaim the "truth" regarding ANet's lack of a plan when they do things such as introduce a rune trader to alleviate the grind of rune farming.

Memory = good. You should try it.

have you ever been in a situation where you were required to use your brain? or does it just sit atop your head with nothing to do?

Fire Childe · Jun 24, 2005, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mistress Dasha

thanks for pointing out the obvious... again when you have your fissure armour then what... your prolly going to stop playing and by your post you prolly will stop before you acomplish your goal..

many appologies didnt mean to flame but a stupid comment deserves one

you misinterpreted my post and missed the follow up reply. thanks for being oh so uber friendly though. the internet is great like that isnt it?

as for the trash talk here, there really is no need to troll the crap out of this thread. the OP wanted constructive ideas. not petty insults.

Mistress Dasha · Jun 24, 2005, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ba Ne

Ideally (in my world anyway) you'd reach the 3/4's complete mark or so, maybe more, obtain the best there is (through normal gameplay) and then enjoy the last 1/4 of the game using your items. After the game is finished, put it down until the expansion is out and then continue on.

This game is essentially a SP RPG that you can co-op with real people online. Once you beat the story of a SP RPG do you keep playing just to farm items? For what purpose since there is no more quests/missions to do? Of course you don't. You expect to obtain them while still having things left to do so when you reach the endgame you've experienced all you could.

in all the RPG's I have played I have never been max just by playing the game when I got to the end. and I highly doubt you have either... just thinking of all the FF games I have played lol. hmm maybe I should drag out 7 for old times.. 8)

Rasp · Jun 24, 2005, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cap'n Hoek

Yeah, you only like to proclaim the "truth" regarding ANet's lack of a plan when they do things such as introduce a rune trader to alleviate the grind of rune farming.

Memory = good. You should try it.

Incase you don't know, majority of people who farmed for runes, were doing it to UNLOCK them. Having the Rune Trader did NOT in any way alleviate the grind of rune farming, unless you want to buy runes everytime you start a new PvP character, then I guess you're right.

May I ask, what's the point in ending majority of your posts with a troll'ish sarcastic ( In general - Asshole ) remarks? For kicks?

Oh, I forgot... +1!

Algren Cole · Jun 24, 2005, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mistress Dasha

in all the RPG's I have played I have never been max just by playing the game when I got to the end. and I highly doubt you have either... just thinking of all the FF games I have played lol. hmm maybe I should drag out 7 for old times.. 8)

I've always had the Ultimate weapons before I finished any of the Final Fantasy games..

*for those of you without a brain this is not a post for or against 'grind'...merely a comment about Final Fantasy*

Mistress Dasha · Jun 24, 2005, 07:36 PM // 19:36

and Childe many appoligies all that was just for the

wear it probally comment 8P.... just got me goat is all...

Cap'n Hoek · Jun 24, 2005, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rasp

Oh, oops. I have made a mistake. I have gotten your posts confused with others.

It must be the witty sarcastic troll remarks that you're using to raise your e-Ego +1 that got me confused. So sorry.

Kids these days, and their sarcasm.

No need to be sorry, though I do find it somewhat suspect that you would mimic my sarcastic, trollish remarks if they offended you so.

And e-Ego? No, I just like to defend my point of view with a little humor on the side. Funny ha ha, you know?

Now go away, old man, or I shall taunt you a second time.

Sandman Uk · Jun 24, 2005, 07:43 PM // 19:43

We are going off the mark here. I wasnt asking for Fissure armour to be given to me. If you read the first post I was asking for them to give a fair base price for a rune.

Fissure armour could cost anything up to 300k+ and I want to try and obtain it but with the money available going down it will be unreachable, I dont mind putting in 200 hours to reach it but at the moment at 25g a superior it will be 3,000 hours to acheive that amount of money with how the games going.

Re Balance the game from the changes they made to accomadate the PVP brigade